Author Topic: 9/11 Conspiracy  (Read 7948 times)

Dan7

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9/11 Conspiracy
« on: February 01, 2023, 03:39:15 PM »
Hello everyone, I was doing some leisure research on the Bush presidency and came across the 9/11 attacks. I know that 9/11 is a controversial subject, and I am not well-informed on the matter, and as such, I am basically neutral on the matter. However, I found the following information online, and am wondering what your guys' opinion is on it.

Quote: "Larry Silverstein - is a Jewish American businessman from New York. Silverstein obtained a 99-year lease on the entire world trade center complex on 24 July 2001. The towers were in fact close to worthless, being filled with asbestos, yet Silverstein “felt a compelling urge to own them” and took out specific insurance against acts of "terrorism". Silverstein had breakfast in "Windows on the World" restaurant (located in North Tower 107th Floor) every morning but broke this routine on the morning of 11 September 2001. Silverstein’s two children, who also worked in the WTC, were also absent from work that day. Larry Silverstein was paid $4.55 billion in insurance money as a result of the destruction of the WTC complex. He also sued the airlines and airport security, seeking $12.3 billion in damages, though his ultimate payout after a 13-year legal struggle was just $95.2 million. Silverstein was a personal friend of media magnate Rupert Murdoch and former Israeli prime minister Ariel Sharon. Haaretz reported that he was such good friends with Benjamin Netanyahu that he spoke with him on the phone every Sunday." The website I got this from, wikispooks.com, claims that Israel played a role in the 9/11 attacks. More is found on https://wikispooks.com/wiki/9-11/Israel_did_it.

Quote: "ZIM, an Israeli company, vacated its office (10,000 square feet) in the North WTC tower a week before 9/11, breaking its lease. 49% of this company is owned by the Israeli government. The lease ran till the end of 2001, and it cost the company $50,000 to break it early. Later, FBI agent Michael [CENSORED], who was investigating Israeli spying before and after 9/11 and looking into the suspicious move, was removed from his duties by the then head of the Justice Department’s criminal division, Michael Chertoff, another Jew and staunch supporter of Zionism.
According to a non-official cover (NOC) CIA source who worked closely with [CENSORED], the 'Israeli movers' moved in explosives when ZIM moved out. With ZIM Israel bailing out just in time, this left one Israeli company, Clearforest with 19 employees, in the WTC on 9/11. Of the five employees in the building all managed to escape." wikispooks.com

Quote: "Israeli instant messaging company, Odigo, admitted that two of its employees received instant messages warning of an impeding attack 2 hours prior to the first plane hitting. Haaretz reported that the workers "informed the company's management, which immediately contacted the Israeli security services, which brought in the FBI." Micha Macover, CEO of Odigo, stated that "It may just have been someone who was joking and turned out they accidentally got it right."[20] Odigo had a feature on its service that allowed the passing on of messages through a search feature based on nationality.[citation needed] Knowing these two particular Israelis were forewarned, it is possible - even likely - that they passed the message on to other Israelis. This is especially so considering that, out of the 4000 Israelis believed to have worked in and around the WTC and the Pentagon only FIVE died. 5/4000 Israelis. Statistically, with no forewarning about 10% (ie 400 of 4000) would have died; a toll as low as 200-300/4000 would not convincingly indicate foreknowledge. But only FIVE Israelis died and two of the five were aboard the allegedly hijacked flights; thus only three Israelis died in the WTC itself on 9/11. NB - this applies to Israeli nationals, NOT American Jews. Many Jews died in the WTC on 9/11. Odigo has offices in New York, and in Herzliya, Israel. Herzliya also happens to be the home of the Mossad Headquarters. Odigo was later acquired by another Israeli company called Comverse. The CEO of Comverse was Kobi Alexander a dual Israeli-US passport holder, spooky businessman and convicted fraudster." wikispooks.com

Additionally, wiki spooks claims that all "this applies to Israeli nationals, NOT American Jews. Many Jews died in the WTC on 9/11".

As I stated, I am not well-informed on the topic and have no way of knowing if the quotes or websites I sourced are "quackery" or not. I would appreciate any clarification on the matter or thoughts on the above quotes that may prove deep-state involvement in the 9/11 attacks.

Thanks
« Last Edit: February 01, 2023, 03:50:38 PM by Dan7 »
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

Kenneth Winslow

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2023, 08:11:19 AM »
Dan, most of us are aware, and many of us are well studied, on the conspiracies that currently plague our world.
Though it isn't wrong to discuss this stuff, after a while it becomes redundant. We could spend all our time delving into the corruption that we see around us every day.
If anyone wants to take about 9/11 that's fine. Personally, I have what I believe are some very interesting documentaries on the topic.

However, studying the wickedness of the world isn't glorifying to the Lord.
Most of us here prefer to discuss scripture and the doctrines of the Lord Jesus Christ.

I hope you understand.
Nehemiah 8:8 KJV — So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

Rowan M.

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2023, 09:14:59 AM »
I'd be very cautious of anything implicating Israel or the Jews in acts of significant evil. In many ways, Israel today is quite a wicked nation. The vast majority of its citizens are not born again, and even many of the Jews there don't practise their religion (or they are into corrupt variations like Kabbalah). Nevertheless, if there is one country in the world that Satan hates more than any other, it's Israel. And if there is one group of people he hates with just about as much vehemence as Christians, it's the Jews. That is because God has a covenant with Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and their descendants. And for all their ongoing rebellion and unbelief, He has not forgotten about it. Also, a key moment of Christ's return will be Israel welcoming Him as its Messiah. That couldn't happen if Israel didn't exist, so it's a major reason why Satan would like to wipe out Israel and the Jews - as indeed he has attempted to numerous times.

The Devil's hatred for Israel and the Jews is reflected in the hatred that the world in general has for Israel. For example, whenever Israel tries to defend itself or do things within its own sovereign territory, the United Nations usually passes a resolution condemning it. The mainstream media is always extremely sympathetic to the Palestinians and frequently negative in its coverage of Israel. This was the case for instance when Israel fought a short war with Hamas in May 2021. Certainly in NZ, our mainstream media devoted almost 100% of their coverage to the Palestinian perspective and gave almost no airtime to the Israeli point of view. The Left also got very uptight about Israel trying to deal with Hamas, yet they remained largely silent about other conflicts going on in the world at the time, such as a war in Yemen that claimed over 200,000 lives, many of them children. There is a constant effort by Israel's enemies to make it always look like the bad guy. Now as I say, Israel is not without sin. There are things it can be justly accused of. But there are many things it is WRONGLY accused of by its enemies. The Bible moreover shows us that those who hate Israel also hate God:

Keep not thou silence, O God: hold not thy peace, and be not still, O God. For, lo, thine enemies make a tumult: and they that hate thee have lifted up the head. They have taken crafty counsel against thy people, and consulted against thy hidden ones. They have said, Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation; that the name of Israel may be no more in remembrance. For they have consulted together with one consent: they are confederate against thee: The tabernacles of Edom, and the Ishmaelites; of Moab, and the Hagarenes; Gebal, and Ammon, and Amalek; the Philistines with the inhabitants of Tyre; Assur also is joined with them: they have holpen the children of Lot. Selah. (Psalm 83:1-8)

Cutting Israel off from being a nation is the exact aim of today's Palestinians, and indeed the hope of Muslims everywhere. The Palestinians are not so dissimilar to the ancient Edomites, who are reproved and judged by God for their "perpetual hatred" of Israel (see Ezekiel 35:5). One of their favourite tactics is to falsely accuse Israel and make it seem like a villain. The God-hating world happily joins in. So that's why I say you need to be very careful of anything making serious accusations against Israel or the Jews. Doesn't mean we should give Israel a free pass in everything it does, just that it's important to understand how much misinformation and malicious disinformation that is in circulation about that nation and its people. As a matter of fact, Hitler based his persecution of the Jews on false conspiracy theories about them. (Conversely, the Psalm 83 passage I quoted above shows a real conspiracy against Israel by God's enemies.)

I would therefore be extremely sceptical about any claims that Israel played a role in 9/11, because that is implicating Israel in mass murder. Now who would want to make that sort of implication? The Devil and his earthly servants. What better way to make Israel seem evil in people's eyes? That said, if 9/11 was an inside job by the US Government, I suppose Israel COULD have done something in its capacity as an ally of America. But to me, this sounds like another piece of fake news planted by those who "take crafty counsel" against Israel on a regular basis.

Just on 9/11 generally: while I think there are valid reasons to doubt the official story, it's not something I personally like to spend a lot of time on. The same applies to things like the Moon landings, who shot JFK and the recent pandemic. There are good reasons to doubt the official version of events in the case of these and other major moments in world history, but I don't believe that the Lord wants me expending too much time and effort on figuring out what the real story is. The Great Commission is to preach the Gospel, not expose or explore conspiracies. When I look at the Gospels and New Testament epistles, I see a fair amount of effort put into exposing and warning against false teachers, and nothing too much about conspiracies. Of course, you have liberty to spend your time however you want, Dan, but we are told in Ephesians 5:16 to redeem our time, because the days are evil. Which is a better use of our time for the Lord: studying His Word and witnessing to others, or researching conspiracies? Of course, we shouldn't be ignorant of Satan's devices (2 Corinthians 2:11), but one of his favourite devices is to distract us, and a way he commonly distracts Christians is to get them going down various conspiracy-related rabbit holes. So please be aware of that danger. And also, please take note of what Kenneth has said.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2023, 09:20:50 AM by Rowan M. »
Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth (John 17:17)

Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2023, 11:38:19 AM »
Hello Kenneth,

It's my desire to be active on the forum, and I'm looking forward to more discussions on biblical topics with you guys. I fully agree with you that we shouldn't really focus on these topics.

However, I know that all of you are Christians, and if there is anyone I would approach when faced with such controversial topics, it would always be Christians. I don't want to poison myself with false information, and I believe that CLE members will point me to the truth. I apologize if I offended you, as that was not my intention.

Additionally, I will refrain from asking additional questions on the topic until otherwise guided.

Finally, I apologize if I am being redundant, as that is likewise not my intention.

Thanks 
« Last Edit: February 02, 2023, 11:51:47 AM by Dan7 »
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2023, 11:48:44 AM »
Hello Rowan, thank you for your lengthy response.

I agree with you that I should not really focus on the topic, as there are many other important biblical topics to focus on, and I apologize if I claimed or quoted anything incorrectly.

With that being said, the comments on my post are advising me to cease my discussion on 9/11, and I'll follow their advice. 

Once again, thanks for your lengthy response. I appreciate it.

« Last Edit: February 02, 2023, 11:50:46 AM by Dan7 »
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

Kenneth Winslow

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2023, 05:49:06 PM »
Dan, why did you say this?

With that being said, the comments on my post are advising me to cease my discussion on 9/11, and I'll follow their advice. 

No one advised you to cease your discussion on any topic.
In fact I said just the opposite:

If anyone wants to take about 9/11 that's fine.

What I also said was:


However, studying the wickedness of the world isn't glorifying to the Lord.
Most of us here prefer to discuss scripture and the doctrines of the Lord Jesus Christ.

I hope you understand.

Can you please explain what this is about?
Nehemiah 8:8 KJV — So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2023, 11:23:38 PM »
Hello Kenneth, thank you for your response.

I see what you mean, and I agree that I may have unintentionally taken it too far. I held that your comment was advising against my posting this, but now I see that I am wrong.

My intent was that if any of my posts/actions were upsetting any of you or causing harm, I should not pursue such topics. Anyway, my current 9/11 post is not in-depth and broken, so I'll post a new one that is much clearer/to the point.

I hope that you do not view me as a contentious member of the forum. If I have displayed such behavior, I sincerely apologize. My desire is to seek the truth biblically, and I believe this forum is one way of achieving this.

In short, I hope that you do not view me as a person that misrepresents and causes contention. I admire your open-book preaching and wish the best for you.
 
Thanks  :)

"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2023, 11:54:49 PM »
It has nothing to with upsetting anyone. It has nothing to do with harming anyone. It has nothing to do with causing contention. As far as I'm aware, no one even hinted as such things, so where are you getting all these ideas from?

The reason this is odd is because you told us you just got saved literally a few weeks ago. So it's weird that your conversation is mostly about moon landings and 9/11 and other such topics. ??? It's strange; not what we normally see from new Christians, and there's a lot of reasoning behind that, especially considering the story you told us in your testimony.
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
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Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2023, 11:48:09 AM »
Hello Chris,

I was watching your "CLE Chats", and forgot to mention that in my original post. You brought up some interesting points, such as the 9/11, pearl harbor, and moon landing conspiracies, and I was interested in finding out what they are all about. After all, finding the truth on these topics is not easy, and many conspiracies are outright falsehoods.

As I also mentioned in a reply to my introduction post, I believe that I've "been" a Christian my whole life (simple prayer for repentance), and have believed in Christian doctrine and creation my whole life (with great knowledge in both subjects). I hadn't truly repented in a biblical fashion, however, and that is what I felt I needed to do to be a true Christian.

Finally, I know that some of my responses may seem direct or rude, and I apologize. It is mostly from my experience commenting on social media in the past years, as some comments I've come across are extremely deceptive. In some cases, I had to assume the worst-case scenario, and that often made for one misleading comment. For example, when Kenneth stated "However, studying the wickedness of the world isn't glorifying to the Lord. Most of us here prefer to discuss scripture and the doctrines of the Lord Jesus Christ.", from experience (and other comments I've received on other platforms) such a comment would imply that if I were to continue discussing this, I would face ridicule and in rare cases expulsion from a given platform. I know for a fact, however, that you guys have proven to be biblical Christians (and would never display such behavior), and hence I have promptly apologized.

This all may sound like an unintelligent practice, and in most cases, it's probably because it is. I truly don't mean it, and it's a habit I'm getting rid of.

Note: Can you delete my original post on the 9/11 conspiracy? It's a bit broken up into irrelevant parts, and I'm planning on upgrading my post with a newer, cleaner one.

Thanks.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2023, 12:00:49 PM by Dan7 »
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

creationliberty

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2023, 01:11:49 PM »
As I also mentioned in a reply to my introduction post, I believe that I've "been" a Christian my whole life (simple prayer for repentance), and have believed in Christian doctrine and creation my whole life (with great knowledge in both subjects). I hadn't truly repented in a biblical fashion, however, and that is what I felt I needed to do to be a true Christian.

Okay, so that leaves me confused about what you believe. Did you ever get a chance to read this?
http://www.creationliberty.com/articles/whymillions.php
If so, what are your thoughts on it? I'm curious because there seems to be a disconnect somewhere between what we believe and what you believe, especially concerning repentance and faith, and I'm trying to figure out what it is.
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
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Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2023, 01:46:19 PM »
Hello Chris,

Yes, I fully agree with your article.

I stated "Although I claimed that I was a Christian, I continued to sin. And I knew that I was a hypocrite" in my introduction post.

I also put the word "been" in quotations (in I believe that I've "been" a Christian) in this post, as I was a Christian by name (i.e. in my own view, not God's). The quotations implied that this was my faulty opinion, and I should have clarified this. I meant to say that simple prayer does NOT grant repentance, not the other way around.

Finally, I stated that "I hadn't truly repented in a biblical fashion, however, and that is what I felt I needed to do to be a true Christian", as I know that a simple prayer does not grant repentance.

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 brought to my attention the fact that I had not repented in a biblical fashion, and hence I was not a true Christian until I repented in grief. I now know that a quick, simple prayer (as I had done years ago) is not true biblical repentance.

The following stood out to me the most from your article and the Bible:

1) "So when James asks, "Can faith save him?" he is not talking about faith in general, but rather, he is pointing out that there are two types of faith. There is a fake (dead) faith of lazy churchgoers who think attending their weekly services will earn them a place in heaven, and a true faith of the children of God, who bring forth good fruits". Great distinction.

2) James 4:6-10

3) Matthew 13:3-9: What a wonderful parable! All need to understand this parable as stated in Mark 4:13

4) Mark 4:16-17: I'm sure this has applied to me throughout my life, along with Luke 8:13

You're correct that this topic is way more important than any conspiracy, and I hope that I clarified my beliefs.

« Last Edit: February 03, 2023, 02:09:39 PM by Dan7 »
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

creationliberty

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2023, 03:30:30 PM »
Quote
Finally, I stated that "I hadn't truly repented in a biblical fashion, however, and that is what I felt I needed to do to be a true Christian", as I know that a simple prayer does not grant repentance.
2 Corinthians 7:9-10 brought to my attention the fact that I had not repented in a biblical fashion, and hence I was not a true Christian until I repented in grief. I now know that a quick, simple prayer (as I had done years ago) is not true biblical repentance.

Then, you were not a Christian; just a churchgoer. If you had come to repentance a few weeks ago, then you had not been saved until a few weeks ago because repentance is given to a man along with faith and salvation. This is why I don't think you understand what repentance means; something isn't adding up here. ???
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
-Psa 34:18

anvilhauler

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2023, 03:32:29 PM »
I'd be very cautious of anything implicating Israel or the Jews in acts of significant evil.

It seems that today people throw the terms 'Jew' and 'Israel' around without having any understanding of the history of the people or the land.  Many seem to have some idea that the whole population of Israel are the remnant of the Tribe of Judah plus some people of the other tribes, but they have no knowledge that when the northern tribes were taken into captivity and moved out of the land then peoples of the east were brought in to the region of Samaria to occupy the land.  The descendants of all of those people are still there today and probably along with lots of other foreigners.

Also today many seem to think that the Samaritans were some kind and Godly people and hence the common phrase we hear of "a good Samaritan", but people have no idea that that term was only picked up from Jesus' teaching.  So all-in-all when people are speaking of Israel today they are actually referring to peoples who are not at all the children of Jacob or the stranger sojourners who joined with them but rather the children of the surrounding nations.
And the remnant of Jacob shall be in the midst of many people as a dew from the Lord, as the showers upon the grass, that tarrieth not for man, nor waiteth for the sons of men.  Micah 5:7 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2023, 03:49:01 PM »
Hello Chris,

I think I see what you mean, that I'm probably confusing biblical repentance with something else.

If I understand correctly, repenting is an action, and repentance is a gift from God. I may have misused these definitions.

If that does not clear things up, can you quote my specific statements that are incorrect?

If you just want my general stance, I agree with everything outlined in your article "There is no saving grace without repentance".

Thanks
« Last Edit: February 03, 2023, 03:53:52 PM by Dan7 »
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

creationliberty

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Did you get saved recently or not?
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2023, 10:13:39 AM »
In the recent book I wrote called There is No Saving Grace Without Repentance, I use the Scriptures to prove the definition of repentance is "grief" or more expanded for mankind's sin is "godly sorrow of wrongdoing." Based on the obvious title, I also prove that one cannot be saved unless first given repentance from the Holy Spirit. (2Ti 2:25)

That being said, let's review Daniel's posts:

1.
https://www.creationliberty.com/forum/index.php?topic=1663.msg13794#msg13794
I’ve always considered myself a Christian, but I never truly repented until January of this year. I felt the need to truly repent after reading Matthew 7:21-23, as I knew that despite the fact that I continuously attended church, I needed to repent in true heartfelt grief over the sins I’ve committed (lying, cheating, etc…). Although I claimed that I was a Christian, I continued to sin. And I knew that I was a hypocrite. I needed to display humility due to the sins I knowingly committed while professing to be of Jesus Christ. I read that Jesus wanted me to come to repentance (the desire for ALL to come found in 2 Peter 3:9) and that I needed to humble myself (humble myself as a little child found in Matthew 18:3-8), or I “shall not enter the kingdom of heaven” (Matthew 18:3-8). I was sitting on a chair with my computer at night following some research and realized that I needed to accept God’s gift of repentance. With all this in mind, I repented and truly came to Jesus Christ.

Again, he said, "I never truly repented until January of this year." Therefore, if he has never had any repentance of his sin, there was never any saving grace, which means he was never a Christian until January of 2023.

In a later post in this thread, I pointed out that Daniel claimed he had gotten saved just a few weeks ago, to which he replied with a weird statement:

2.
https://www.creationliberty.com/forum/index.php?topic=1666.msg13832#msg13832
I believe that I've "been" a Christian my whole life (simple prayer for repentance), and have believed in Christian doctrine and creation my whole life (with great knowledge in both subjects). I hadn't truly repented in a biblical fashion, however, and that is what I felt I needed to do to be a true Christian.

Daniel seems to be disagreeing with me that he got saved a few weeks ago, but puts "been" in quotes, not clarifying what he means. He does not seem to be treating this as a point of salvation and regeneration in the Holy Ghost for him, but rather, he seems to be treating repentance like some ritual he had to do to be "complete" somehow. Therefore, since he was a churchgoer for so many years, I asked him his opinion on my book, Why Millions of Believers on Jesus Are Going to Hell, and he said he fully agreed with it, which means that nothing he's saying is making any sense because I can't get a straight answer.

Was he a Christian all his life? Or did he get saved a few weeks ago? I just want to get to a straight answer because, whichever one he tells us, there are some problems that need to be addressed, but I can't get that far in the conversation because of the elusiveness.

3.
https://www.creationliberty.com/forum/index.php?topic=1666.msg13836#msg13836
Finally, I stated that "I hadn't truly repented in a biblical fashion, however, and that is what I felt I needed to do to be a true Christian", as I know that a simple prayer does not grant repentance. 2 Corinthians 7:9-10 brought to my attention the fact that I had not repented in a biblical fashion, and hence I was not a true Christian until I repented in grief. I now know that a quick, simple prayer (as I had done years ago) is not true biblical repentance.

This is so on the fence, I can't figure out what he believes. Was he saved a few weeks ago, or does he believe he was a Christian his whole life? It can't be both. He can't say that he agrees with me that being born again in Jesus Christ requires the gift of repentance, and then say he was a "Christian" his whole life, but then put add in the word "true" to make it seem like he was and was not a Christian his whole life.

4.
https://www.creationliberty.com/forum/index.php?topic=1666.msg13839#msg13839
I agree with everything outlined in your article "There is no saving grace without repentance".

Something is really off here. I would love to have a direct statement on what Daniel actually believes about salvation, instead of just saying he "agrees" with me because, so far, I don't see any agreement. ???

I could not care less about 9/11 or moon landings or climate change scams right now. Daniel, do you believe you have been saved for (x) amount of years? Or, do you believe you were born again in Christ (being brought to repentance, and therefore, saving grace) a few weeks ago when you said you came to repentance? A short, concise answer would be wonderful; you can skip all the formalities as if you are writing formal letters... it's just a basic conversation, so just a straight answer would be very appreciated.
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
-Psa 34:18

someguy85

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2023, 11:14:15 AM »
You're not wrong that 9/11 is a "controversial" topic and there is a lot of speculation on it, I just wanted to throw a few things into the mix.

First off, I have no doubt in my mind that the "official" version of events is complete fabricated junk, and even that label is giving it too much credit. actually, let me put the discrepancies I know into a list, this is by no means all of them but some of the most glaring flaws of the official narrative.

A building hit on one side does not collapse into it's own footprint, it should have bent and fallen sideways like the top of a tree when it's been hacked at with an axe

the top of the building would not crush everything underneath it at free fall speed, the rubble would be impeded and should have taken around ten times longer to crush what was under it

Footage of the tower fall shows massive jets of dust and debris shooting out from just a few windows at least 10 stories under the collapse point

Aircraft grade kerosene (QAV) burns in a controlled environment (kind of like gasoline burning in the combustion chambers of your car) at around 2200 degrees Celsius, but in open air, only around 1000...as I learned in high school, an oxy-acetylene torch burns at over 3000 degrees Celsius and even that takes time to melt steel, the impact of the shell of the plane would have done far more damage than the jet fuel would have (most burnt off in the air after impact, interesting fact, I tried a butane torch on a thin angled piece of aluminum that was set to burn at around 1200 degrees Celsius, and it didn't even want to bend.)

They expect us to believe that an aircraft black box was destroyed in a crash (the initial story) but somehow they knew the high jackers because they found their passports among the debris? Last I checked paper and cardboard could withstand very little punishment (Although an Insider article from December of 2018 says the black boxes were "never recovered"...funny how the story changes when convenient.)

A phone call was made at 32,000 feet when the chances of that call actually connecting at working was a small fraction of a percent (And for some reason the guy calling his mum used his first name and surname...when have you ever needed to use your surname to identify yourself to your own parents?  ???)

Building 7, one of Silverstein's buildings was also demolished despite having suffered no fire damage at all. (in an interview, Silverstein said he authorized demolition at advice of the fire department, despite the fact that a building demolition is something that takes days to plan, it's not like throwing up a shed in an afternoon.)

The part of the Pentagon that was hit was not only not burned in a fireball but the wing span of the jet was WAYYY wider than the actual site of impact.


That's to say nothing of the other claims I've heard but can't confirm or don't have pics to back up:

The base struts of the tower look like they'd been cut with an angle grinder, some accounts say thermite was used

There was a fire in the base of the towers that firefighters were simply unable to put out (again, points to thermite, a simple but very powerful high heat compound)

The wing of the Pentagon that was hit held financial records for the US government that proved there was a few trillion dollars unaccounted for in the US budget

There was supposedly evidence of a case about to be served on Bill Clinton in one of the offices of the twin towers,


At the end of the day though, this was a public power play by someone who was looking to push forward in a plan bring the one world government closer to a reality (No, not George Bush Jr, he's way too fried on whisky and cocaine to be intelligent enough to pull of anything close to something like that, he was like the warm up for Creepy Joe Biden.), and it was probably made so public to cover up something else, but there are so many levels to things like this that we will probably never know the actual truth about the how and why in this world.

At the end of the day, the bible tells us the base reason why this happened, Satan hates humanity and wants to bring his world system to earth, but will be cast into the bottomless pit so there is no hope for him...there is however hope for those who are still alive to come to repentance and faith in Christ for the forgiveness of sin. The prophecy of Revelation was written nearly 2000 years ago, and there are parts that we are seeing fulfilled today, but Jesus did say it's not for us to know the times and the seasons for these things to come to pass, so all we can do is work to deliver the gospel.

In short,  yes, the official story of 9/11 is as rotten as the morning after a taco-bell binge.
Romans: {11:3} Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life. {11:4} But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to [the image of] Baal.

Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2023, 08:32:31 PM »
Hello Chris, I now see what you mean. I’ve worded this based off of your points (#1-4). I never had repentance until 2023, which means I was never a Christian until 2023. I was only saved a few weeks ago. I also accidentally used the terms “repent” and “repentance” interchangeably. I wasn’t saved until a few weeks ago. I meant to say that I now understand that a simple prayer is not repenting. I believe that I was only saved a few weeks ago this year. I hope this clears everything up.

"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2

creationliberty

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2023, 11:28:37 PM »
Thank you for the clarification.

Now, that being said, there are a number of people in our church that find it very weird that, as soon as you have allegedly been given godly sorrow for sins committed, that your conversation is COMPLETELY focused around worldly conspiracies. What some folks having been trying to explain to you is that: This is NOT a normal, reasonable reaction to the situation.

It's like someone pushes you out of the way of an oncoming bus, saving your life, but dying in the process. And as soon as it happens, you turn to the person next to you on the sidewalk and say, "So did you see football game last night?" That is NOT a normal, reasonable reaction to the situation.

When someone has just recently experienced the gifts of repentance (and 'repent' and 'repentance' mean the same thing), that is, the knowledge and understanding being unlocked of one's wretchedness, to see sin for what it is, the grief of heart over it, to be saved by Christ, and transformed into a new person... their conversation usually reflects that. In fact, we have two newer members to our forum, Chris and Morgan, and we have seen that in their conversations, but we don't see it in yours, and that's what's concerning some of us, and it's why I typically do not like to weigh in on these types of threads you've started because I don't want to encourage you in something, when there is a MUCH bigger looming problem at hand.

You are probably unaware, but there are folks in our church who read this forum, and some of them are concerned and a bit cautious of you right now because we have seen this pattern before. Essentially, it's a person who comes in and "decides" one day that they need to come to Biblical repentance, and they experience something called "remorse" or "regret," which is not the same as repentance, but they think it's the same as repentance, and then, when they join this forum, they just talk about all the worldly garbage that's important to them because, in actuality, nothing has changed within them, but they want us to believe they have been converted.

This is a pattern that some of us have watched happen in numerous people over the past decade since our church was founded, and it ends poorly every time. I am not saying necessarily that you are one of those people, but what I am saying is that your conversation so far reflects the same conversation of those contentious people we've had many problems with, in which you are focused on the things of this world, and writing with formalities to impress us. That's not what we've come to expect to see when one has been humbled to repentance and born again in Christ, and the conversation of a true convert is not something anyone can fake 'til they make it.
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
-Psa 34:18

Dan7

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Re: 9/11 Conspiracy
« Reply #18 on: February 05, 2023, 04:37:51 PM »
Hello Chris,

I see where you are coming from. I probably did not mention this in my introduction, but I found creationliberty.com a month before I repented. I found your articles well-researched and informative, and they answered most questions I had about Christianity. Thanks to that, I don’t feel the need to ask many questions I otherwise would have felt the compulsion to ask. I assure you that I’m not trying to write with “formalities” to impress you guys. I was first introduced these conspiracy theories in a direct manner from the CLE Chat I was watching a week ago. You mentioned that the moon landing the moon landing was the greatest conspiracy in America (or something of that sort), and such a statement aroused my interest in the subject. In short, I’ve begun to ask about conspiracies as I feel that all of my questions about Christianity have been answered (either by your website or other people). I assure you that I have no intention of causing contention in this forum and that I’ll apologize for any inappropriate/wrongful action that I take (which hopefully will never occur again). I’ve already tried my best to apologize for my inappropriate responses on this forum, and I hope to prove myself as a friendly, non-contentious, and most importantly Christian member of this forum.

By the way, I’m planning on asking about various biblical topics in the coming days pertaining to the rapture, the second coming, and other topics.

Thanks
"Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord... I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord." -Jeremiah 23:1,2