Messages

1

General Discussion / Re: I have decided to leave

« on: July 01, 2019, 07:50:05 AM »

Dear Chris,

As you may have read above, I now request you to remove me as a member.
I want to thank you for all the teachings. And, honestly, I have learned a lot here!


I have been blessed by you, Chris, and the many teachings (articles and videos)
I have learned lessons, I won't forget. For that, thanks again.

God bless,
Joop

2

General Discussion / I have decided to leave

« on: July 01, 2019, 07:43:03 AM »

Dear all,

I have decided to leave CLE
I am not giving here my motivation as to why I have decided that.
Instead I refer you to my last posts and comments on this forum.

Communication is proven to be hard. I am now judging myself.
Obviously I did not succeed to give proper answers and comments.

I am not sure what else to write
Therefore I stop right now.
God bless you all
Joop

3

Bible Discussion / Re: I Am Accused of Something Called "Modalism"

« on: July 01, 2019, 04:15:55 AM »

Me:

However, I did read some commentaries on Isaiah 9:6 which were quite helpful to me.

Joop. That right there is your problem.

My comment: I didn't read just one commentary. And yes, I know, commentaries can be flawed (from Ruckman, Scofield)

However: in the teaching of the Trinity, Christ gave also a commantary: "everlasting Father" would be "God the Father" i.e. the first Person of the so called "trinity".
I don't agree with that.

You are comparing me with Edward. Actually, I haven't read or seen anything from Edward.
You are saying that when Jesus said: Me and my Father are one" would be the same meaning as: "Me and my Father are the same"
I don't agree with that.

When Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist, a voice came from heaven, as we know. The voice from God the Father. How come that Jesus and the Father are the same? Clearly there were three distinct persons: The Father, the Son, being baptized and the Holy spirit (as a dove).
If you are correct, Tim, that would mean that at times there are three distinct persons, and (mostly?) the three Persons are one and the same (i.e. no distinction anymore)

Yes, I know, we cannot comprehend everything, especially when it comes to the -so called- trinity.

What is being taught here is VERY new to me. That said, I readily admit, this is not an argument.

1 John 5:7 - For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Yes, they are one. But are they the same?
I am curious: Do you know of any Christians who also teach this. (Brian Moonan? Nate Marino?)

I rest my case here.
I hope we can agree to disagree here and move on.
Thanks for your elaborated respons, Tim.
God bless, Joop

4

Bible Discussion / Re: I Am Accused of Something Called "Modalism"

« on: June 30, 2019, 11:18:38 AM »

This quote comes from the teachings on het Trinity:

The Lord God has always been three disctinct persons from before the creation

Always. Yes I agree. But then, also from this teaching (Bold added):

The Lord Jesus Christ, who is God the Father, was less than the Father while he was in the flesh because He humbled Himself to the form of a man for the purpose of fulfilling the prophecy of the Messiah. After He returned to the Father, He was then again equal to the Father because they are one, but whether or not we fully understand this is not a requirement for believing its true.

That is, to me, a contradiction: Either The Lord God has always been three distinct persons from before the creation or The Lord Jesus Christ is, sometimes?, God the Father.

To say that "God is Three Persons" is an over-simplification of who God is, and it's also part of the "Trinity" concept of witchcraft from their triple goddess

The Lord God has always been three disctinct persons from before the creation

So, which one is it?

Maybe I am messing up with the semantics (English is not my native language). However, I did read some commentaries on Isaiah 9:6 which were quite helpful to me.

5

Bible Discussion / Re: I Am Accused of Something Called "Modalism"

« on: June 30, 2019, 06:01:50 AM »

Again, then, how do you explain this?

Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

My explanation would be: The everlasting Father is a title rather than a designation that Jesus and God the Father are the same.

We are his children. Whose children? God's children.

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2


Either God the Father and God the Son are two distinct persons, or they are the same.
To me, the latter would be (a form of) modalism:

modalism: the doctrine that the persons of the Trinity represent only three modes or aspects of the divine revelation, not distinct and coexisting persons in the divine nature
or

the theological doctrine that the members of the Trinity are not three distinct persons but rather three modes or forms of activity (the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) under which God manifests himself according to Merriam-Webster.

I have an analogy too: I am Joop, and I have arms and legs. When somebody would touch my arm, he is touching me (Joop). When somebody is touching my leg, he is also touching me (Joop). Yet my arms are quite distinct from my legs.

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Bible Discussion / Re: I Am Accused of Something Called "Modalism"

« on: June 30, 2019, 04:06:18 AM »

My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.
-John 10:29-30
While it is clear from this scripture that Jesus and the Father are one, it still raises the question: Are Jesus and (God) the Father the same? I don't think so.
Jesus and the Father are two distinct persons.
The Father is God. Jesus is God. The Holy Spirit is God. While at the same time, Jesus is not (God) the Father.
What do you think about that?

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Introduce Yourself / Re: Greetings Brothers and Sisters

« on: June 28, 2019, 02:15:38 PM »

Letting go of unforgiveness and learning to love people (including myself) which all helped a lot with the headaches

There is a good teaching about loving ourselves on this website. Use the searchbar and type "loving ourselves".

Just as there are good things being tought in church buildings.

The problem is, as I have experienced quite often in the different denominations: there might be some truth, but when it comes to the Truth, they hated it. I spent decades in the pentecostal movement. You believe me, it is very cultish, i.e. not christian at all.

I just know I have had a very different life than anyone I know

Well, yes, who hadn't?

I know we all are different parts of the body of Christ and my part is unique

Well, I would never say that about myself, I suppose. Rather I would emphasize: There is only ONE (Jesus) Who is unique. And important.

We are all here to help and love eachother

Indeed, so you are on the right place.

8

Introduce Yourself / Re: Greetings Brothers and Sisters

« on: June 28, 2019, 09:26:38 AM »

Hi Christy,

Welcome to this forum. I read your testimony with interest. I do, however, have some concerns.

From the time I was 5 I have suffered with extreme migraine episodes.  It wasn't until about 6 months ago I discovered it was connected with my strong since of discernment

Discernment from whom? I am asking since you were at age 5 not yet a born again christian, as I might suppose.

As Jeanne pointed out:

You said your migraines were related to your discernment, so how could you spend so much time in the New Age movement without being in excruciating pain?

That was exactly what I was thinking as I was reading your testimony.

Anyway, you are on the right place here! God bless, Joop

9

Bible Discussion / Re: The term Christian.

« on: June 16, 2019, 11:03:21 AM »

I also should mention that Antioch was the first place where the disciples were called Christians. That would imply that, after Antioch, there were more places / towns where the disciples were called Christians.

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Evangelism / Re: One-liners anyone?

« on: June 16, 2019, 10:36:22 AM »

How about this? "Jesus is the reason why I reject this season of Sin"

Actually, this is a very good one-liner. And very biblical indeed.

Hebr 11:25 [Moses] Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season.

11

Bible Discussion / Re: The term Christian.

« on: June 16, 2019, 10:28:23 AM »

Hi Charles,

I gave your post some thought.
First, as you said:

In our society, the majority of people you speak to will claim to be a Christian.  The liar, cheater, fornicator, thief, etc, they all who attend church and those who don't if they have been told they were saved at some point in their lives will refer to themselves as Christians.  To us, it really puts folks an a generalized group that can live anyway they want in the eyes of society.

The tag 'Christians' has been diluted and misused ever since.

However, as I see from the context:

And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch
What I see is this: 'Christians' is linked to 'disciples'. So that would mean that 'Christians' were (in Antioch) real Christians, i.e. disciples
It was written down by Luke. From the context is would seem to me that 'Christians' was not a man-made tag.
If it was, we should not use the term 'Christians'. I believe, Luke made a statement, rather than put forward a term we should not use at all.

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General Discussion / Re: THE FRUITS

« on: April 01, 2019, 10:48:58 AM »

I am sad Masha left.

13

Bible Discussion / Re: Looking for Analysis on this Anderson Video

« on: March 30, 2019, 04:45:01 PM »

O no! I misspelled Chris' name. Can somebody please correct that?

14

Bible Discussion / Re: Looking for Analysis on this Anderson Video

« on: March 30, 2019, 04:38:30 PM »

That being said, I seems should be:...It seems. (my apologies)

15

Bible Discussion / Re: Looking for Analysis on this Anderson Video

« on: March 30, 2019, 04:34:46 PM »

I watched part of the video and the comments here.
I want to state here: Steve Anderson as an abusive and violent man. And this video showed his true colors. I couldn't watch it all. It was really heavy stuff for a quite and nice saturday morning.
I guess (just guessing) these -full of violence video- triggered Masha to write what she wrote. (Again, just guessing).
I myself listened to (most) of the Steve Anderson serie. It was helpful for me. I learned a lot of how he manipulates people. But I just could only listen. Now in this video, by seeing Anderson, his violence has much more impact. Much more than just by listening.
Studying a violent man can be tough if you have a background of violence or occultism. Which I don't have, but I guess (just guessing) Masha does have.

I have stayed away from all these teachings for a reason, what a waste of time!

No, to me it is not a waste of time at all! And I am thankful to Chris he puts a lot of time and effort in this series.
That being said, I seems some people, like Masha, cannot handle this serie (yet?)
Again, just guessing.
God bless you all.

16

Bible Discussion / Re: Looking for Analysis on this Anderson Video

« on: March 30, 2019, 05:46:17 AM »

I couldn't watch the whole video. Too disgusting, like Masha said.

And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth  2 Tim 2:24-25

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Bible Discussion / Re: 2 Thessalonians 2 - What is the meaning of he that lets?

« on: March 29, 2019, 04:09:23 AM »

I'm somewhat amazed that I can see these things so easily but others, well, can't.

That's, off course, you are special  , and the others aren't.

18

Bible Discussion / Re: The Last Beast Empire Of Revelations

« on: March 28, 2019, 02:55:00 PM »

I see you posted again while I was writing this.

Nope, that was me, Joop

19

Bible Discussion / Re: The Last Beast Empire Of Revelations

« on: March 28, 2019, 02:52:42 PM »

I would be interested though in seeing the proof that Donald Trump's name is an indication that he is the antichrist.  If the name doesn't match the 666 then he definitely can't be.


Revelation 13 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: 17 and that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. 18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

There is no connection between Donald Trump and the number 666. So to claim that Trump is THE antichrist is not very wise, so to speak.

It's not a lie, it's the truth. I've tried to open up a bit of what happened to me about 2 years ago but it's hard for me to do. It's hard for me to explain. When I tell others about it, they think I'm crazy. It involved the CIA, the Secretary of State, the POTUS and Benghazi. But that's all I really care to say about that.

You are teaching all kinds of conspiracies without giving any proof. That's not very helpful.
I myself like reading and studying the Book of Revelation, however, I am very careful how to interpret this book. I think you have to be more careful, Mat!

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General Discussion / Re: Realistic song!!

« on: March 25, 2019, 01:23:26 PM »

Once you stop criticising (critiquing) then you are well on the way to disaster.  In the church buildings I was always criticised for criticising.

 

Very true! I have had the same experience in 'my' former pentecostal 'church'.
However I am not happy Celeste decided to leave. I hope she reconsiders the matter.