Author Topic: That Shroud  (Read 781 times)

Offline anvilhauler

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That Shroud
« on: June 22, 2016, 02:54:16 AM »
I'm not saying here that I believe the shroud of Turin is the burial cloth of Christ.  For me, the too intact beard and the lack of more severe facial injuries and the long hair give me the most serious doubts.

Anyway, I was having another look at Chris's article (www.creationliberty.com/articles/shroud.php) about the shroud of Turin and of course Chris notes that the scripture mentions there also being the head napkin.

Chris points out that:

"I will argue this is NOT the cloth Jesus was buried in, and I can prove that from the Scriptures."


Then cometh Simon Peter following him, and went into the sepulchre, and seeth the linen clothes lie, And the napkin, that was about his head, not lying with the linen clothes, but wrapped together in a place by itself.
-John 20:6-7


The head napkin is actually one of the things that has caused the researchers to be most puzzled over the years because it does exist.  The believed head napkin is called 'The Sudarium of Oviedo' and any information about it can easily be found on the documentaries about the shroud on YouTube etc. 

This head napkin has a history that can be traced back to about 700AD and has always been separated from the shroud.  It is made of the same linen as the shroud and has the same weave and also the blood stains match those on the shroud.

Although the shroud of Turin is currently in the hands of the Roman Catholics that has only been the case since about 1980 when the private owner then gifted it to the "pope".  It is interesting to note that the Roman Catholics don't seem to have much regard for the shroud as it was reported that without telling the wider world and without any scientific input from interested parties around the world they removed the backing sheet and cut out some of the burnt areas and gave it an ironing and all of that apparently done with bare hands and no regard for dealing with an archaelogical artifact. Of course the last thing the Roman Catholics want is for the general population to be taking an interest in the crucifixion and then looking further into it in the Bible.

Hmmm, why bother mentioning all of this?  As Christians, the subjects of whether the Earth is flat or spherical or if the Earth is at the centre of the solar system/universe or if the shroud of Turin is real (or not) hopefully holds no relevance in the life of those who have accepted Christ. 

Hopefully all of us are not of those who have to see something in order to believe.  Even many of the Jews saw the miracles that Jesus performed and were then happy to watch him be executed. 

John 20:27-29
Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.  And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.  Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.


We also live in a time when many false things will come about in the future and will decieve many people.  Part of life as a Christian is sifting out what is relevant and what is not.  In the future there will be real things we need to pay attention to  ......   and false things that we need to dismiss.  Dismissing things that are not relevant needs to be a way of life.
Psalm 119:165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

Offline anvilhauler

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Re: That Shroud
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2017, 09:37:42 PM »
As I was scrolling through the list of articles to read the article on Charity I happened to see again the article on 'The Shroud of Turin' so out of interest I have had another read of the article.  There is I believe a piece of information missing that proves that the 'The Shroud of Turin' can NOT possibly be the burial cloth of Christ.

Exodus 20 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:


If the shroud was the burial cloth of Christ and the mysterious image was created by God then it means effectively that God has violated his own rule.  Some might say "Oh but it is made by God and therefore not by man"  ....  some others may say "Oh but it isn't a graven image"   .....   but   ......  that then creates a problem   ......   as soon as any man takes a photograph of it and develops that photograph you have created a graven image.  When a black and white photograph is developed that is creating an etching or is actually chemical engraving.

Photoengraving
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoengraving

If that shroud image were made by God then He would be causing people to sin because He would know that it would only be natural for people to create drawings of what they see on the shroud (or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above) or photographically produced graven images (Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image).

From a technology perspective it is still interesting as to how people created the forbidden image but from the scriptures we can clearly see that it wasn't created by God and so therefore can NOT be the burial cloth of Christ.
Psalm 119:165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

Offline Masha

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Re: That Shroud
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2017, 08:05:15 AM »
totally agree guys, the shroud is fake. Never thought of it to be anywhere near real. All ctaholic idolatry, just like pieces of bodies of the apostels and stuff that they have stored in their churches. All fake and occult idolatry. Worshipping the dead by the dead.

Offline creationliberty

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Re: That Shroud
« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2017, 12:00:13 PM »
That may be another good point about the graven image; that if we are not to make them to ourselves to worship, then God would not make them either. I had a guy write me complaining about the Shroud a couple months ago, but I didn't waste any time with him because he start arguing a bunch of technical scientific points he found on wikipedia, and completely ignored Scripture, so that told me he's just someone playing church.
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Offline Suelong88

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Re: That Shroud
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2017, 10:00:07 AM »
Thanks for that Kevin.  I'd never thought of that being a graven image.  But it really is. 

I was in a Greek Orthodox church yesterday for a choral concert and was apalled at all of the graven images around.  So gaudy.  Just from my vantage point I could see at least 4 images of Jesus on the cross.  And a bunch of other stuff that is so pagan.  The all seeing eye was very prominently displayed.  And they had an image of the crucufixion in stained glass that had a skull and bones beneath.  (My husband said it looked like a Storm Trooper so I couldn't get that thought out of my head and almost laughed outloud a couple of times)  I asked someone about it, because I'd never seen that before and someone 'explained' that it was Goliath's skull that is supposedly buried in Golgotha and is why it is named the place of the skull.  But it will always be a Storm Trooper to me.  ;)